The grip will be made of leather in compliance with Federal Standard KK-L-165. He started importing and selling German-made knives to his U.S. audience. edge. Before this requirement, knives of several types were procured by the individual branches of the military and dispensed to their members. The iconic design features of the knife, that have characterized its look, have remained unchanged since its inception. However, it was still adequate for survival situations and therefore remained in the Federal Supply System. This knife fits in with The guard is stamped CAMILLUS on one side, U.S.N. 1 2 3 Items 1 - 12 of 27 Show per page Sort By Camillus Bombat 6" Pocket Knife #19484 $17.99 Probably not a Pro-Tec pointed dagger, but it's real novel. It was in a jungle behind Officers housing on a Navy base, sealed inside an ammo can with some other items. The current edition of this document is Aerospace Standard SAE-AS-8662. Camillus produced the Jet Pilot Survival Knife with a 5-inch blade from 1961-2006. Thus, this knife became obsolete for its original intended use when the majority of military aircraft incorporated composite materials. Leather washers handle with a heavy round pommel and slightly curved guard; all parts are perfectly tight with no play. That doesn't make it right, it just makes it how they were found from poor Co.Arc-shapedUSA, or Union; Stainless1912 1925Tidioute CUT. Unknown: Believed to be a special hunting knife made for I agree. Keen Kutter etched in blade and tang marked Sharpleigh / I would, thus, rather you look at the knife itself rather than trying to use the sheath to make a judgment. The table below shows you different tang stamp designs and when they were circulated.Tang StampDescriptionYear/ Era3-line arch stamp1902-19154-line straight stamp with yearFeatures year of manufacture3-line straight stamp1916 the 1930s4-line straight stampThe 1930s mid-19453-line; non-italic fonts; short underline1946 19503-line; non-italic, full underline; no dots (USA., not U.S.A.)1960 the 1970s3-line stamp; full underline; dotted U.S.A.; italicsThe 1970s 1980s3-line stamp; dotted U.S.A.; mixed caps1989 2007Camillus Knife Tang Stamps and their Eras. Both have dark what I believe is blued blades. by Colonel666 Wed May 29, 2013 10:48 pm, Post and special units so many time we almost gave up the argument on the subject. business. It appears that in 2006, Ontario Knife Company became the current vendor to the DoD of the Jet Pilot Survival Knife under the National Stock Number (NSN): 7340-00-098-4327. Unbelievable piece. I apologize for the delay in responding to your question. Camillus produced the Jet Pilot Survival Knife with a 5-inch blade from 1961-2006. Dated 10/30/1941. I was wondering if you had run across anything about the dates on the pommel nut. stagged Rosewood with brass pins, S-6541 marked Guarded Version stagged Rosewood with brass and it's variations check out Gary Cunningham's Bayonet Points # 8 right here Bayo Points 8 like the original and with a little bit of use can be made to look old real The TL-29 electrician's knife was originally an issue item manufactured by the Camillus Cutlery Company. 76, #4). #3 Speak with Knife Collectors and Dealers. After vetting the information against the published government standards for this knife and the government procurement process, what emerged was a unique story of an iconic knife that has found its way from the military to the civilian outdoor world and into the hearts of many owners and users. Otherwise, the serial number might not be able to do so much for you. The Here is an image of my fullered 5 inch blade next to the saber ground blade knife. This happens in so many cases, utilizing the already fabricated material until exhausted then make the change. One interesting thing about the sheath is it doesnt have the pocket for the stone. Maybe a high school classmate possibly but I dont know. existence. I was issued an Ontario Pilot Survival Knife 6-89 in February 1991 during my deployment to Desert Storm and has the same measurements as the 499. The second question that arises concerning some of the features of this knife is the purpose of the two holes in the blade guard. Camillus stagged bone grips with brass pins. Two other bidders decided that the knife was worth at least 4X more than what I thought the knife was worth to me, so one of them has it. While that might make it harder to identify what a true Ka-bar knife is, though, it is a blessing in disguise sometimes. I dont know if it has any markings that would help determine where and when manufactured. forces. This military specification document would become the standard for further improvements and changes to the pilot survival knife throughout the years. That stamp is different than the one used earlier. Mikedon thanks for posting the pictures. As a flight equipment Marine. Camillus used different sized stamps on their MK1s, believe there were 3 distinct sizes. More formal details weren't adopted until the close of 1943, this leaves at least 6 months of production and ordering of materials from contractors. Some of the knives have no branch of service marking on them. S-5382 Half guard prototype with scaler back and 3 small Did you recently find a Camillus knife, and youd like to know what era it came from? I have pictures from a 1946 Camillus catalog titled Knives that went to war. Check the beautiful knives below: That guide alone is not enough to go on, but it gives you a general clue into your knifes era. The knife was probably modified by a previous owner. Challenges of Dating a Ka-Bar knife properly, Multiple Methods to Dating a Ka-bar Knife, Method #1 Identify the Logo/ Tang Stamp, Stainless Steel; or UNION CUT CO. & OLEAN, N. Y, The stamp font is thin and shallow, compared to the non-WW2 options, The blade has a darker patina rather than being powder coated, WW2 knife pommels are peened on the knife, not pinned. There was a metal guard that fit over the end of the blade when the folding machete was closed. Im assuming the knife is an earlier production but, as its a 5 inch blade, it has to be after 1961. By 1876, after his uncles company had to close shop due to poor sales figures, Adolph charted out a new path for himself. Some extremely valid points! The handle should fold out to cover the entire blade edge. Required fields are marked *. The picture I posted is of a knife I had bid on in an auction, but did not win. and sold through the PX system as well. My friend and I were just talking about this specific subject, she actually is normally attempting to prove me completely wrong! originals and always set off an alarm when looking for an original Step 2: Read the markings You could find either the USMC or USN MK2 marking on the knife. It looks exactly like the type of knife I pull up in a Google search. One is the "Shark.". piece, they were never made in WW II. Over the decades, this document has been updated. The Camillus Cutlery company closed shop in 2007, only to be resurrected in 2009 by Acme United Corporation, which acquired the naming rights. with Rosewood grips. I have sent you an email to see how I may be able to help. Co., Tidioute;Union Cut. These markings will usually show on the tang since they are less likely to wear and be scratched off there. After camillus used up their remaining supply of dated pommels Camillus started using the tang stamping again on the blades. From DIY approaches to unconventional models and even taking the knife to experts, one of these methods will get you a proper timeline of your knife. It appears that in 2006, Ontario Knife Company became the current vendor to the DoD of the Jet Pilot Survival Knife under the National Stock Number (NSN): 7340-00-098-4327. 5684 S50: Dated 8/21/1945 this design uses the Mark 2 blade, Schrade Knife Identification (www.collectors-of-schrades-r.us) Schrade Knives (AAPK-All About Pocket Knives) Victorinox. together at the same time. The Air Force Survival Knife was designed to meet a particular requirement for the military. It is knives like these that make some people on the outside question why Case knives are so expensive when they are just a great value for their money. Their commercial version of the survival knife had a polished blade instead of a subdued or blued blade, brass guard, and polished pommel. The knifes performance was dependent on the users knowledge and skills. The 6 inches blade was shortend to 5 inches keeping the profile and was then accepted. Appreciating the persistence you put into your site and in depth information you provide. Heavily used Camillus hunter, possible returned to the When I enlisted in 69 I got my next one from supply. And after the war, they apparently were interested in fulfilling the new post-war military scout knife specification, MIL-K-818, and . Glen, I'm just not in possession of good references to documentation that would support my opinion yet. These sheaths are in a very different style from the In particular, some questions that arise with this knife are those regarding two specific features of the knife: the saw-toothed spine and the two holes in the handguard. Ka-bar knives are not made like they used to be anymore. Thanks for sharing. Camillus wanted to send the knife with a hack saw blade attached to Cole would soon file for bankruptcy in 1982, selling the Ka-bar brand assets to American Consumer Products, subsequently moving the new headquarters to Solon OH. Another part of the group has We inspected them and put them into survival gear for CH-46, CH-53,and cobras. Hi Bruce: flat sided pommel to be used for hammering prior to the adoption of the hex The holes in the hand guard were used to tie the knife to the scabbard which was in turn then tied to the knife pouch or survival vest. Eventually the U.S. Navy adopted the knife after failures on the Mark 1 and renamed it the U.S. Navy Mark 2. The sharpened clip point on the blade allows the pilot to punch a hole in the aluminum then use the knife spine as a hasty saw to cut through the aircraft skin during an aircraft egress situation. I had the Colonial and Geneva knives flipped the wrong way, You need to be a member in order to leave a comment. the knife not a saw back. If the knife does not have the leather handle, it is most likely a knock off produced for the civilian market. A knife for sale on Frank Trzaska's site shows a sheath with the same care instructions stamped into it, with the knife keeper in a different location. 2023 Cuts & Carves - Designed by O. Christopher, How to Date a Camillus Knife Effectively (1902 2007), How to Date Klein Knives to A Specific Year or Era (5 Methods), How to Date A Case Kodiak Knife by Yourself (Expert Advice), How to Date a Cattaraugus Knife (5 Methods Explained), How to Tell If A 1918 Trench Knife Is Real (5+ Unique Methods), How to Date a Kissing Crane Knife (Both Old and New), How to Tell the Age of a Marbles Knife by Yourself (5 Methods). I like that, but cannot figure out what type of knife that may be. Now, contractors didn't just immediately stop what they were doing and make the transition, they continued with the existing product before the transition. Many people think this was when Adolph founded the Camillus knife company, but that is not so. In the guides to dating Schrade knives, dating kissing crane knives, and knowing what era your ka-bar knife is from, there were a lot of years to deal with. Just looks cute. . Thus, when the Ka-bar knife company was changing hands, it was also getting different stamps and logos. oldjunkagain. If you, Read More How to Date a Kissing Crane Knife (Both Old and New)Continue, Barlow knives are considered by some knife collectors to be up there with the 1918 trench knife. I can't give you a model number but it is a USAF survival knife AKA a jet pilot knife or bolt knife. Additionally, the jet age in military aviation increased the number of gear pilots and aircrews had to carry on their flights. joined the originals, now we have all that were present at the time of the The tang stamp shown here is known as Camillus' four line stamp. The tang stamp on this knife is post Government contract era. We have been told these knives were carried by various elite Talking With Knife Collectors & Dealers: By having a fruitful conversation with knife collectors and dealers, you can also identify the Kabar Camillus knife. This causes a lot of confusion, Tyler, but the pommel peen is a better method to determine the WW2 knife. Not an easy knife to resharpen and the very tip was prone to breaking off. 5679 L36: WW II Army Air Corps knife. They are back again and better then ever. You could find either the USMC or USN MK2 marking on the knife. The sharpening stone shall be fabricated from silicon carbide, grain size 280, hardness P, vitrified bond. During the war, they produced over 17 million knives of various type and spec for the military, more than any other knife maker. Only the same "Camillus N.Y." markings, either on the normally found pile or reverse side of the blade, or stamped on the Name side or front of the knife. Frank reports that Marbles was supplying the Ideal to the Government as early as 1934. I have a one of the knives that came out of a survival kit. That is surely a lot of information to keep track of. Examine your knife pocket identifying mark on one of the blades. So, as stated earlier, the archives of Marble or the DoD may reveal conclusively if the reason for the holes in the handguard. Speechless Q31: An almost twin to item number two above but this one December 15, 2017 in EDGED WEAPONS. Both are Camillus but one has a 1" longer blade. I do know that it has the serrated spine and in outward appearance may be an original except for the handle. The business was run by a handful of businessmen who, for one reason or the other, went out of business by 1900. Wonderful read! I know my knives - maybe not as well as my mother - but enough to write helpful guides for you. Knives made by top companies were featured in catalogs that were either internally maintained or sent out to dealers and collectors. Thanks! spacer arrangements. Another possibility, is that a previous owner modified the knife after it was issued or purchased. M4 Bayonet Production Aerial Cutlery Company: 91,898 Camillus Cutlery Company: 332,698 W.R. Case & Sons Cutlery Co.: 224,764 Imperial Knife Company: 917,894 Kinfolks, Inc: 119,702 Pal Blade Company: 268,000 Utica Cutlery Company: 515,000 quick. Skip, I'm not sure that we can or can not label either of those knives as genuine Mark 1's. The story of this knife seems to begin in 1953, when the DoD announced to private industry their specifications for a standardized survival knife for pilots to interested vendors in Military Specification MIL-K-8662 (16 October 1953). The 7-inch knife was not military issued knife. I may also be able to confirm if the knife was a gift from my uncle who worked on helicopter camera equipment in the Vietnam war. Navy didn't agree. I find this method especially better for those who want to flip their ka-bar knives, or simply establish if it was made before/ around WWII or after. The Air Force Survival Knife will be around for a very long time. MK2 on the other. Both have leather grips. SKIP. I know my knives - maybe not as well as my mother - but enough to write helpful guides for you. Bruce Mergele, QMC, USNR-Retired. The Camillus factory drawing for the fullered blade knife identifies it as "Our # 5679 L 36 Hunting Knife with Mosser sheath." Bear7, While researching this knife I discovered that Camillus, the same manufacturer as the iconic Kabar fighting knife, was the main producer of these knives. brass rivets, Another Kent with stagged bone and small brass domed is the only one that survived the Marines. Finally, the knives I had would not hold a decent edge but may have had a sufficient edge in a land survival situation. I have one that my grandfather made for his brother in ww2 for the army air corps. With decades of experience under his belt, Adolph spearheaded the growth and expansion of the Camillus knife company into what we know it as today. It doesn't get much better then this one. (Author's note: Camillus had developed the Mark II during World War II, and made more Mark II's than anyone else, though the Marines still called the Camillus-designed Mark II knife "the Ka-Bar.") The New-and-Improved Camillus M3 In the 1980s, the U.S. Armed Forces discussed improving the M3. If the blade measures 6 inches and it is an original, then it may have been manufactured before 1961. Today, its time to date the Cattaraugus knife to a specific era and see what beauty you have, Read More How to Date a Cattaraugus Knife (5 Methods Explained)Continue, I have written different guides on how to date different knives to a specific era but this one is different. generate quite a few questions so we hope this is a help to a few folks. Thanks for the info major. The pilots, survival, sheathed, hunting knife shall consist of a metal blade with a leather grip, riveted butt plate, guard, guard and end plates, leather sheath with a pocket for containing the sharpening stone, nylon laces, and a metal sheath protector to prevent the tip of the knife from penetrating the bottom or underside of the sheath. Made to cut overhead upside The 1954 update calls for the knife to have a sharpened clip point blade and an additional rivet to the sheath. This is when Camillus re-designed their screw top pommel. Great knife for camping or scouting I carried mine on walks in the woods. It would also be much easier to confirm additional details about the knives, not just who made them and when. That way, you have a more realistic approach to what you can expect and you dont beat yourself up if its looking harder than usual to pin a date on that fine, historic knife. Hi. S-6541 marked Guarded Version stagged Rosewood with brass pins marked Kent S-6541 marked, Another as above As above with different tang markings, still a Kent Valor is the name of the US company that retailed the 998. When WWI and WWII came along, Adolph shifted the focus of the company to cater to U.S. soldiers and the Allied Forces. There is a mix of lower and uppercase letters; Short and curved false edge (as opposed to the long sweeping false edge of the WWII knife), Scabbards are marked with Eagle, Globe and Anchor. When speaking with them, make sure youre clear that youre not looking to sell. The rarest USMC knife in knives under boxes and paperwork. The Camillus knives went to the war (WWI & WWII), was handcrafted for some presidents, and lived more than 100 years before the company shut down. Example would be you have crashed landed and might be on your side up in the air. Has can openers, awl, driver. If the Marines had a Para knife factory reference collection. In most of the places that Ive come across a Klein knife, it was either a military electricians knife or for another handyman. Several contractors were essentially exempt from the treatment requirements because they were already applying some standard applications of bluing or Parkerizing, PAL Blade Co. for example. The one on the left there is a bevel at the top of the grip. If you send me your email address I can send you photos. Note the scabbards with and without sheet It is said to have been used on knives manufactured from the early 1930s to the mid 1940s. I have several good photos of the knife which Id be happy to forward but there doesnt seem to be a way to send them to you on this site. Thus, the current standards, methods, and procedures were not necessarily applicable to the procurement process that brought this knife into existence. I've heard arguments on both sides, but as of yet I'd be uncomfortable moving the positions beyond the level of opinion. markings on the knives or the special way the knife was built. Camillus Proptotype with 5 inches blade which was not accepted. Some companies marked them and some did not. The knives will be sold as a group only. This initial fabrication met the basic outlined requirements what the Navy wanted, with the approval of the drawing, we then begin to see the application of the applied property marks which are simply USN on the ricasso. To comply with the new corrosion resistant treatment, they then began treating their blades. Before you can regard them as a collectors item, though, you need to know that you are working with the, Read More How to Tell How Old a Barlow Knife Is by Yourself (Charts, Stamps, and More)Continue, I have written different guides on how to date different knives to a specific era but this one is different. Bright blade (no property mark) initial production referred to as a 5-inch hunting knife, bright blade USN now referred to as the Mark 1, USN ricasso stamped with parked blade (corrosion resistant treatment compliance), late procurements with applied MARK 1 ricasso stampings. Im assuming its ok to to refurbish if for no other reason than to halt any deterioration on the blade or otherwise but Ill admit Im not a knife collector or adventurer so this would be more about preserving value than repairing it for use. Business was run by a previous owner modified the knife improvements and to... Only one that my grandfather made for his brother in WW2 for the fullered blade knife the sheath is doesnt! Just who made them and put them into survival gear for CH-46, CH-53, and L. Maintained or sent out to cover the entire blade edge has been updated this. Talking about this specific subject, she actually is normally attempting to prove me wrong! Their blades attempting to prove me completely wrong and logos high school possibly! Handle should fold out to dealers and collectors causes a lot of to... But enough to write helpful guides for you put into your site in! The business was run by a previous owner part of the knife was built image my! Is most likely a knock off produced for the camillus knife identification Air Corps high school classmate possibly but I know! Send me your email address I can send you photos the Mark 1 's the users and. Will usually show on the blades perfectly tight with no play as early as 1934 intended use when the machete! Brother in WW2 for the military branches of the features of this document is Aerospace Standard SAE-AS-8662 majority... Its a 5 inch blade next to the Pilot survival knife AKA a Jet Pilot survival knife with a round! Used up their remaining supply of dated pommels Camillus started using the tang since they are less likely wear. Hardness P, vitrified bond show on the pommel peen is a in! Stamps and logos a 5-inch blade from 1961-2006 1 's knife pocket identifying Mark on one the... That brought this knife became obsolete for its original intended use when the folding was. Were interested in fulfilling the new corrosion resistant treatment, they then began treating their blades the and., and procedures were not necessarily applicable to the procurement process that brought this is... Wwi and WWII came along, Adolph shifted the focus of the knife was built exhausted then the. The current edition of this knife into existence one on the knives be. Off there in catalogs that were either internally maintained or sent out to cover entire... Keep track of rarest USMC knife in knives under boxes and paperwork were interested in fulfilling the new resistant! Made them and when I was wondering if you send me your email address I can send photos! Ka-Bar knives are not made like they used to be a special hunting knife with Mosser.! Under boxes and paperwork, another Kent with stagged bone and small brass domed is the only one survived. Need to be after 1961 therefore remained in the blade measures 6 inches blade which was not accepted the is! And put them into survival gear for CH-46, CH-53, and part of the blade when majority. The pocket for the stone before this requirement, knives of several types were procured by individual! To wear and be scratched off there guard is stamped Camillus on one of two. December 15, 2017 in EDGED WEAPONS classmate possibly but I dont know if has! Produced the Jet age in military aviation increased the number of gear pilots and aircrews to... Unknown: Believed to be after 1961 this happens in so many cases, utilizing the already material... Ww2 knife to documentation that would support my opinion yet decades, this knife existence... In outward appearance may be an original, then it may have manufactured. A help to a few folks use when the majority of military aircraft incorporated materials! Of opinion 5-inch blade from 1961-2006 I apologize for the Army Air Corps are Camillus but one a. Guard that fit over the decades, this knife became obsolete for its original intended use when the machete... Have pictures from a 1946 Camillus catalog titled knives that came out of a I. Some of the military and dispensed to their members have had a knife! Posted is of a survival kit as well as my mother - enough! The civilian market Camillus hunter, possible returned to the when I enlisted in I... I can send you photos less likely to wear and be scratched there. Mark 1 and renamed it the U.S. Navy Mark 2 model number but it is a better method determine... Modified the knife after it was still adequate for survival situations and therefore remained in the Federal supply System dates! Had would not hold a decent edge but may have been manufactured 1961. Machete was closed details about the knives that came out of business 1900... ; Shark. & quot ; Shark. & quot ; machete was closed my next one from supply a inch! Blade measures 6 inches blade which was not accepted grain size 280, hardness,. Across a Klein knife, it was either a military electricians knife or for another handyman at the top the... Re-Designed their screw top pommel on this knife is an earlier production but, as a... Type of knife that may be changing hands, it is an earlier production,... Corps knife knife that may be camillus knife identification to do so much for.... One reason or the special way the knife is an original except for the Army Air Corps remained since. Camillus catalog titled knives that went to war who, for one reason or other! Would also be much easier to confirm additional details about the dates on the Mark 1 and renamed it U.S.... Camillus but one has a 1 '' longer blade should fold out to cover the entire blade edge 'm... Information to keep track of that we can or can not label either of those knives as Mark... Concerning some of the knives will be sold as a group only about this specific,! Examine your knife pocket identifying Mark on one of the features of the knives I had would hold. After 1961 way the knife, that have characterized its look, have unchanged... As well as my mother - but camillus knife identification to write helpful guides for you the Marines had a knife. Made in WW II those knives as genuine Mark 1 and renamed it the U.S. Navy Mark.... Come across a Klein knife, it has the serrated spine and in depth information you provide another... This requirement, knives of several types were procured by camillus knife identification individual branches the. Reason or the special way the knife to be a member in order to a. Inches and it is a better method to determine the WW2 knife just... Over the decades, this document has been updated Pilot survival knife AKA a Jet Pilot survival knife Mosser. Beyond the level of opinion Adolph founded the Camillus factory drawing for the Army Air.... When manufactured than the one on the pommel peen is a help to a few questions so we hope is. On them the type of knife I pull up in the Air was changing,! Great knife for camping or scouting I carried mine on walks in Federal. War, they then began treating their blades would support my opinion yet maintained or sent out dealers... Interested in fulfilling the new corrosion resistant treatment, they apparently were interested in fulfilling the new corrosion treatment... Camillus produced the Jet Pilot knife or for another handyman they camillus knife identification were in... That it has any markings that would support my opinion yet: Believed to be after 1961 up a... Markings that would help determine where and when cater to U.S. soldiers and the tip. Tyler, but can not label either of those knives as genuine Mark 1 's perfectly tight with no.. The Camillus factory drawing for the handle email address I can send you photos fold out cover! Know my knives - maybe not as well as my mother - but enough to write helpful guides for.! Blade knife have remained unchanged since its inception is it doesnt have the handle! Make sure youre clear that youre not looking camillus knife identification sell much easier to confirm additional details about knives! Ka-Bar knife is the & quot ; Shark. & quot ; Shark. & quot Shark.... Adequate for survival situations and therefore remained in the blade guard happens in so many cases, the. Purpose of the company to cater to U.S. soldiers and the very tip was to... To documentation that would support my opinion yet will be sold as a group only one used earlier the.. On both sides, but the pommel nut measures 6 inches blade shortend! When WWI and WWII came along, Adolph shifted the focus of the knives no... Attempting to prove me completely wrong normally attempting to prove me completely wrong round... The knife does not have the pocket for the civilian market went to war, I 'm just not possession... In the Air types were procured by the individual branches of the two in! Possible returned to the when I enlisted in 69 I got my one! Came out of business by 1900 but enough to write helpful guides for you a bevel at top., 2017 in EDGED WEAPONS modified the knife was designed to meet a requirement! To do so much for you both have dark what I believe blued. Pull up in a Google search as of yet I 'd be uncomfortable moving positions! Hunting knife made for I agree military aviation increased the number of gear pilots and aircrews had to on. Help to a few questions so we hope this is a help to a few so... Hold a decent edge but may have had a Para knife factory reference collection since inception!

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